Elk Hunting Skill

[Swede]

Sometimes I cringe when I hear some hunters blowing on their elk calls. I wonder if they know how lousy they really are. Ok, I want to start a debate today. Weigh in if you like.
I say that people should learn good solid hunting skills before they ever start calling elk, instead of trying to make calling their standard. Calling should be a supplement, and not a replacement. If you do not have the basics down well, all you are doing with a bugle, or even a cow call is educating the elk. Your chances of killing an elk may even be reduced. If you need to refer to an instruction manual when you hear a bull, you should throw your grunt tube in the garbage along with the instructions. You are not ready!
I will go even farther and say that a person should hunt elk five years before they buy their first call or instructions. Say I\'m crazy but explain why, or agree and give evidence.

 

[JohnFitzgerald]

I agree Swede with the exception of the 5 days.

Learning solid elk hunting skills includes learning how to call and when/why to call. Even after the 5 year wait, commercialization will always be a lure. Waiting will not change that. So if you plan to call for elk, compliment your education by learning the basics of elk hunting and elk calling.

My 2-cents!

 

[archery bum]

I read post like this all the time? Here\'s a seasoned elk hunter complaining these rookie elk hunters don\'t know how to blow there elk call. Sounds like crap, there\'s no way an elk will come into that! All elk must sound the exact same way, a long two note flawless ripping bugle. Like the one\'s people win the competitions with, man they are sweet sounding bugles. Well I\'m not the most seasoned elk hunter far from it, but what I\'ve heard in the woods and in videos very few elk sound like that. I\'ve read articles and seen videos of guys that heard the worst sounding elk call in the woods and they all say the same thing. That guy needs to put that call away he sounds terrible. The call keeps coming closer and low and behold its an elk, they look at each other and say I would have never guessed that was an elk. If a call sounds like crap but still gets a response or brings the elk in, then in my opinion it must not sound to bad to the elk.

 

[cohunter14]

I have to agree with Archery Bum on this one for a few reasons. First of all, I believe one of the big reasons people choose to hunt archery season is that they get to hunt the rut. Therefore, their \'solid hunting skills\' are going to be revolving around chasing talkative elk.

Although I don\'t own an elk call of any kind, I have heard that learning how to use them is not that difficult if you put the time in. And if you put the time in, I doubt it takes five years to learn to sound like an elk. I also disagree that if you make a crappy sound, you are educating the elk. The only way an elk gets educated is by seeing who or what is doing the calling. I would argue that someone who has the best sounding calls in the world has a better chance of educating an elk, because there\'s a better chance an elk will come in to one of their calls and see them instead of an elk.

I would also say that the only way to learn something is by doing it. If someone waits for five years to use their calls, they are going to be five years behind where they would have been if they started using them year one. Sure, they might have a few experiences hearing elk during those five years, but that isn\'t necessarily going to tell them how, when, or why to use their calls.

At the end of the day, you have to remember to keep elk hunting simple: find the elk and then hunt the elk. If a call helps to find the elk, why not use it?

 

[mtnmutt]

IMHO, Its the frequency of calling and not understanding variance in calling that us rookies blunder. Not having the perfect call is not what causes the issues of educating elk. Learning elk behavior is paramount. I found out the hard way that calling before knowing elk behavior and learning basic hunting skills is like playing the lottery. It may work occasionally.

My first 3 years in the elk woods was only calling for someone else. I way over called. Rookie mistake. The rookie hunter wanted me to call more often, but it did not feel right to me. I was not the hunter, so I did as told. Once I started doing it my way with less calling, I did bring elk in. Unfortunately, our setups were terrible, so elk winded us. We were both new to hunting and we had no mentors. I have not regrets calling in my early years because I did bring them in, however, I get an F in understanding elk behavior and basic hunting skills.

Calling early in my hunting years did delay me from learning other hunting skills. Therefore, I agree with some of your points. I am now playing catchup on hunting skills that I should have learned in my first 5 years. On opening morning of my first time being the elk hunter (ditched the other hunter). I did a light cow mew to a 4x4 elk 100 yards away and he came over to stand 16 yds broadside. As an inexperienced hunter, I thought that would be the same for all years and every hunting day. I was so wrong. In my case, I had not hunted anything until I started with elk 5 years ago. After all, elk are easy game to start with, right. :think:

 

[Swede]

Here are some basics I believe you should understand before you start blowing on a bugle. It has little to do with the quality of the sound you make, and much to do with which sound you apply to your situation:
No doubt elk make some lousy sounds. That does not excuse the hunter so he/she can hunt willy-nilly. Understand elk behavior. That is important when and where you set up. Will the elk see you, or nothing at all, when they look your way? If so, that is a blown opportunity. Are you using the right call at only the right time? Does the elk need to expose himself to you in order to survey the location where you called from? What route can you reasonable expect the elk to follow. Some things are a guess, but others are predictable. Where will the elk approach you from. If I have a partner, where should the shooter be? Is the wind working in your favor, or is it all a big guess.
I do know that I select the location I call from, and I choose the time, and the call used. To be able to have a reasonable chance at getting an elk I need to understand their behavior.

 

[cohunter14]

Here are some basics I believe you should understand before you start blowing on a bugle. It has little to do with the quality of the sound you make, and much to do with which sound you apply to your situation:
No doubt elk make some lousy sounds. That does not excuse the hunter so he/she can hunt willy-nilly. Understand elk behavior. That is important when and where you set up. Will the elk see you, or nothing at all, when they look your way? If so, that is a blown opportunity. Are you using the right call at only the right time? Does the elk need to expose himself to you in order to survey the location where you called from? What route can you reasonable expect the elk to follow. Some things are a guess, but others are predictable. Where will the elk approach you from. If I have a partner, where should the shooter be? Is the wind working in your favor, or is it all a big guess.
I do know that I select the location I call from, and I choose the time, and the call used. To be able to have a reasonable chance at getting an elk I need to understand their behavior.

Swede, I agree with everything you said. However, isn\'t the only way to learn those things through trial and error? Sure you could read about some of it, but you aren\'t going to learn or know the majority of those things just by spending time in the woods hunting. I can tell you that this will be my 20th year hunting elk and I would still struggle with some of the things you have listed because I haven\'t called before.

 

[archery bum]

Some things are a guess, but others are predictable. Where will the elk approach you from. If I have a partner, where should the shooter be? Is the wind working in your favor, or is it all a big guess.
.

I would say it\'s all a big guess. You can predicted the wind and where the elk are going to approach from on every setup? You are the man! You\'ve never been in a setup with everything perfect and the elk coming in and all of a sudden you feel the wind hit your neck? Game over. Or the elk coming in and just stops for no reason or decides to change direction and flank you down wind? Game over again. If you get lucky and connect, I\'m not sure you predicted what mother nature or a wild animal would do I would say you just got lucky and made all the right guesses. I would say the only thing that would be predictable is if you know the area you are hunting there\'s a good chance you will be in the elk, not kill the elk. I\'ve been hunting for 20+ years and I\'ve seen very few hunting situations that I would call predictable. Just my opinion.

 

[Swede]

If you get lucky and connect, I\'m not sure you predicted what mother nature or a wild animal would do I would say you just got lucky and made all the right guesses. I would say the only thing that would be predictable is if you know the area you are hunting there\'s a good chance you will be in the elk, not kill the elk. I\'ve been hunting for 20+ years and I\'ve seen very few hunting situations that I would call predictable.

That is an interesting statement. When things aren\'t reasonably predictable, I get concerned. Staying low on a hill or in a draw when the diurnal winds are going down hill, or setting up near a ridge when the winds are blowing uphill is not a guess. Staying quiet when the winds are shifting all over is not a guess. Setting up near a rim in cover is not guessing. I agree that wind shifts can come in all wrong, but to say it is just a guess is to say willy-nilly is as good as it gets. To say hunting is just a guess is to say hunters like Cnelk and John F. are hunting very superior areas. I really don\'t know Brad\'s area, but am familiar enough with what John deals with to say he is not just guessing. Hunting does involve some luck, but there is significant skill involved if you are going to be consistent. If we learn to minimize the luck factor, we will increase our score on elk.

Good discussion guys. Thanks