It\'s not complicated - Tone, Intensity, and Pitch

[JohnFitzgerald]

My good buddy Troy(GCHC) called me the other night and we had a great discussion about elk calling. I for one have seen many of a hunter get so wrapped up in \"defining\" what sound the bull made that they loose complete focus on the goal. Troy has really simplified things with the term....Tone,Intensity, and Pitch!

Troy, can you give a brief definition of each.

Tone:

Intensity:

Pitch:

 

[JohnFitzgerald]

Troy\'s been busy. He\'ll be on here soon. Bump to the top!

 

[WW]

As soon as I saw the title of your post, I thought, \"Johns been talking to Troy again\"! Looks like I was right. LOL!

Another way to sum it up with one simple word is (emotion)

 

[Glacier Country]

As soon as I saw the title of your post, I thought, \"Johns been talking to Troy again\"! Looks like I was right. LOL!

Another way to sum it up with one simple word is (emotion)

Exactly WW. How much EMOTION in your calling that you want to convey for a particular situation. What Measure of Emotion are you trying to convey to convince a bull to React and come to you.That is the Cliffnote version.


Tone, Intensity, and Pitch.

I have been describing how I call in elk and teach elk calling to other elk hunters for a long time. So long ago I just started describing what I do, and how I go from one tone or pitch to another up the scale from low to high, with bull calls or High to low with cow calls.
I am not a music teacher so I needed a way to convey what I was trying to relate to others.
When I started describing things in terms of Tone Intensity and Pitch, people seemed to pick up what I was relating a lot better.
So first I should mention that I think that all three are interrelated when it comes to speaking a language - whether it is English or one elk talking to another.
We have all heard the saying ? Don?t use that Tone with me!?
How much emotion is used?
So lets use the word Hey for example? So you might say?
Hey. as in how are you? - a non threatening verbalization to get attention. Then there is an escalation of emotion with Hey Where are you guys. Or Hey dad check this out! More emotion more intensity and usually a higher pitch. Then there is an even higher escalation with more emotion, more intensity and an even higher pitch to anger, yelling ,screaming ? with this version of Hey the intensity is threatening. You are demanding they back down or fight. These are only three versions of the scale and only one word ?hey ? used to show the range of emotion the same word can convey. Of course there are many more than just three from a social Hey to Yelling and screaming , fists flying etc.

Now lets put this into elk terms?
What bugle or cow call should I do in which situation to get the response I want from a bull? Or from a cow for that matter.
Well that depends upon what YOU want that elk to believe is happening in each situation.
So many of you are trying and hoping a bull will respond to your calls ?.. But what you really want is for the ELK to REACT to your calls and give you an opportunity to harvest them.
Once you really understand that it changes how you approach calling ? You don?t just bugle? you do a bugle with a certain MEASURE of Emotion. Hope this Helps---> Troy glaciercountryhuntingcalls.com

 

[JohnFitzgerald]

Thanks Troy. So we can talk about emotion and it\'s very apparent in tone and intensity of the call. But what about pitch? How do you think higher and lower pitch sounds compare?

 

[Glacier Country]

Thanks Troy. So we can talk about emotion and it\'s very apparent in tone and intensity of the call. But what about pitch? How do you think higher and lower pitch sounds compare?

Pitch refers to the high or low frequency of the sound, Tone in musical terms refers more to the Emotion,
This is why Tone Intensity and Pitch are all relative to a conversation, or elk calling .
So without getting too technical...
So what you want to understand is that pitch is low notes to high notes and tone deals with how much Inflection and Emotion, is applied to the pitch. The intensity refers more to the loudness of the tones and pitches, in relation to the sounds as a whole.

 

[JohnFitzgerald]

Troy, what would you say higher pitch sounds symbolize vs. lower pitched sounds. Example, are higher pitch sounds more invitational? Do lower pitch sounds symbolize dominance?

jf

 

[flystrait]

Troy, what would you say higher pitch sounds symbolize vs. lower pitched sounds. Example, are higher pitch sounds more invitational? Do lower pitch sounds symbolize dominance?

jf

I am not Troy! But I will give you my input anyway. I use higher pitch for distance, it will carry further for let\'s say a location bugle. As I work in close inside a comfort zone of a bull \"100-150 yards and less\" I will use more of a mid tone on all my bugles. In my experience with going after mature bulls the majority of them have more of a mid-tone to their voice. Hence I want to challenge them in similar tone. The higher the pitch \"tone\" the more smaller (younger bulls) will come in by percentages in my experience. There is always the anomaly but is not the norm.

To quantify what I am trying to say, the last several years we have only called in few younger \"smaller\" bulls using more mid-tones. The majority have been mature large bulls for the area. Yes a couple have been very large 5 points but the again the majority have been 6 point and larger but are all mature (older) bulls for the area. So I would say lower pitches (tones) do symbolize dominance. I hope this helps.

CK

 

[flystrait]

To give an example of what I was stating, here is a link to our 2013 hunt. At 30 secs to 1:30 min I was calling to the heard bull he has defiantly a mid-tone. Its not the young bull we had footage of from the heard. We actually had the heard bull to 40 yards without a shot due to the brush, but still saw him. He had a large 6x6 frame with a large body. This is typical of the tones by mature bulls we hunt.

<!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygievGrJGP0\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygievGrJGP0</a><!-- m -->

Craig

 

[razorback]

Well now I\'m a little confused. I thought the higher pitched the more intense. Okay so lower means bigger. Does the growl mean a lot or is that the emotion you are speaking of? This will be my first hunt and my goal is a 5 point so I\'m happy to call in a young bull but I\'ll chase a big one too. I\'m told where I\'m going the bulls are typically silent (assume from high pressure) so if I can get in close with the wind in my favor will blasting these aggressive bugles still work or would you just play it safe with cow calls? I\'m hoping to find more that one bulls to try both ways. I have always wanted to have one bugle in my face!

 

[elkmtngear]

Well now I\'m a little confused. I thought the higher pitched the more intense. Okay so lower means bigger. Does the growl mean a lot or is that the emotion you are speaking of? This will be my first hunt and my goal is a 5 point so I\'m happy to call in a young bull but I\'ll chase a big one too. I\'m told where I\'m going the bulls are typically silent (assume from high pressure) so if I can get in close with the wind in my favor will blasting these aggressive bugles still work or would you just play it safe with cow calls? I\'m hoping to find more that one bulls to try both ways. I have always wanted to have one bugle in my face!

Steven I think you just have to adapt to the situation. If you get into vocal elk, pay attention to tone, intensity, and pitch.

For example, if I\'m hearing a couple bulls going off on eachother in the earlier morning hours, sometimes it can be pretty intense! If I can get inside their \"comfort zone\"...I\'m going to want to attempt to mimic that level of emotion with my calling.

If all I\'m hearing is a high pitched, lazy \"location\" type bugle...I will often try to get as close as I can, silently, and then start with some cow calling, and work my way up to some more intense bugling as the situation unfolds.

Some of the biggest bulls I\'ve encountered did not bugle at all...they \"growled\" like a bear. Some younger bulls (2 1/2 to 3 1/2 year olds) I\'ve heard have had some pretty gnarly bugles, and some older bulls have surprised me with their whiny, high pitched bugles. Bulls are capable of a big range of sounds...and they seem to adjust them according to the \"emotion\" they are conveying at the time. Getting \"tuned in\" to the emotion takes a while, but it can be very rewarding.

 

[razorback]

Okay, if I should work my way into a bull bugling, say 150-100 yards. Would you cut him off with a bugle (bugle while he\'s bugling). I do stuff like this turkey hunting. I have read where some hunters say bulls usually don\'t respond so fast to each other and it\'s obvious. You know some days I think I have a good game plan on this elk hunting stuff and some days I think I need to forget everything and start all over. I sure hope I can remember all of the advice from this forum once I get in the mountains.

 

[elkmtngear]

Okay, if I should work my way into a bull bugling, say 150-100 yards. Would you cut him off with a bugle (bugle while he\'s bugling). I do stuff like this turkey hunting. I have read where some hunters say bulls usually don\'t respond so fast to each other and it\'s obvious. You know some days I think I have a good game plan on this elk hunting stuff and some days I think I need to forget everything and start all over. I sure hope I can remember all of the advice from this forum once I get in the mountains.

I50-100 yds is not close enough. 9 times out of 10 where I hunt...he will run his cows over the next ridge. I find that I have to get inside that 80 yard mark to be effective. Most of the time, I won\'t even call until I think I\'m there.

I like to get scary close before I let off with a challenge. That\'s just me. But yes, I will cut a bull off if I\'m in real close...then I\'m moving ahead immediately, and getting ready to draw. It just depends on how agitated he sounds.

 

[razorback]

80 yards is close! I have been in the woods in Colorado before, it seems like I could see about 80 yards through the timber in a lot of places. Are you able to see the bull and just move when he\'s not looking?

 

[elkmtngear]

80 yards is close! I have been in the woods in Colorado before, it seems like I could see about 80 yards through the timber in a lot of places. Are you able to see the bull and just move when he\'s not looking?

Sometimes I\'ve stalked in on them like that. I have also had bulls bust me at that distance...and most of the time, it\'s because I announced my presence prematurely. In most cases if it is a challenge situation, it\'s too dense for me to see the bull at that distance.

Keep in mind...I\'m \"shielding\" with the SLIP Decoy when I\'m moving in. When I think I am close enough...I\'m going to plant the decoy, call, and move ahead and toward the \"downwind\" direction of the bull\'s location to set up for the shot.

In my area, these encounters are mostly in dark timber, although we\'ve had several encounters in oakbrush or aspens, which is more \"semi-open\". Often, they will come in just enough to see where the call is coming from...and an \"educated\" bull will call \"B.S.\" on the situation if he does not see an elk sometimes.

 

[JohnFitzgerald]

I50-100 yds is not close enough. 9 times out of 10 where I hunt...he will run his cows over the next ridge. I find that I have to get inside that 80 yard mark to be effective.

And his name was BINGO!

 

[Glacier Country]

I try to mimic each individual bull. This first clip is a condensed version over roughly 20 minutes. I started with a few cow calls, he did not answer so Went to bull calls. I knew he was there because I could hear him raking a tree. This was in October I knew he had had cows previously but was unsure if he still did.This is how it went. He is in elk heaven.

The 2nd clip depicts a bull that I really get aggressive with .He had 8 or 10 cows and was a Screamer. So I get pretty aggressive with him. he came in to 11 steps. I had already gotten one. My buddy dropped the ball on this one.

 

[Glacier Country]

here is an example of a really Mad Bull! He fights with 1 smaller 6 point and then Runs another 6 point off that comes in while the other 2 bulls are fighting.This is the Sound I originally made Troys Secret Weapon for! I call it the Bull Scream! The Herd Bull is Yelling at these other bulls ,telling them he will kill them. There Should be no doubt in your mind that this bull means business. <!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8</a><!-- m -->