Lip Bawls

J

JohnFitzgerald

New member
Mar 31, 2014
1,108
Why do bulls give lip bawl bugles? I\'ve heard this by real bulls only a hand full of times. Does anyone know why they use it? This is probably the one bull sound I haven\'t developed an opinion on and have no clue what it means.
 
Let me start by simply stating I don\'t know. Most bugling is advertising. It either attracts cows, or out advertises other bulls. A cow guarding bull will try to out do the competition. That is my best guess.
 
Thanks Swede!

Others - I\'m ok with theories or assumptions. Tell me what you think or have heard. Anything goes on this thread!
 
it must be something like( hey sexy lady come with me!!!). I think it is a real strong display of dominance it can really drive a bull nuts when in close. I feel because your basically calling his girlfriend to you. similarly drunks sometimes do this in a bar. it usually starts a fight essentially the same thing happens in the forest. I believe it directed to the cows, bulls repond similar to the boyfriend of the hot chick at the bar ready to defend his woman. thats my human translation anyhow :dk: :dk: . Only time i have heard it was a bull comming to cow calls and one other time when two herds intermixed and a whole lot of chaotic bugling happened there we did hear the bigger bull making a few lip bawls.
 
Only time I\'ve heard them do this is when there\'s obviously a cow in heat. Bull going absolutely crazy to herd up his cows as well as fend off satellites. I\'d guess it is simply the most excited/ferocious sound they\'ve got used when they are really pissed or horny. This is just my guess. You won\'t get too many opinions on this because most seasoned elk killers can\'t discriminate it from another bugle. It takes a lot of listening to elk to start to \"get it\". At least it took me quite a bit. DVDs with actual elk sounds (not just one or two real examples) are a great place to start for those who are scratching their heads on this one.
 
IMO when I have heard a bull lip bawl and was able to see their actions as well, I take it as the ultimate F*** U dominate bull sound./quote]

Totally agree.

I always thought a lip bawl bugle was the bugle a herd bull uses when he is aggressively defending or rounding up his cows. When I am heading for a lip bawl bugle I always assume he is a herd bull and he has cows and usually he has a decent sized harem.

Two scenarios I have seen frequently that involve a lip bawl bugle are one: I get close to a herd bull with cows and blow a challenge bugle. Rather than fight, he wants to take his cows and run and or tell me to f-off. He rips his nastiest lip bawl at me. His cows get into a tight herd. They all run off together at full speed. This is THE reason I no longer do challenge bugles.

Two: A herd bull has a big harem of cows and he is keeping them together. I have seen this a lot in really dense timber where a cow could easily wander away from the herd.

I don\'t know that I am right, but this is what I have noticed.
Click to expand...
 
otcWill pretty much has it right. It is usually a bull that is POed and frustrated. He is putting his cows on notice.(If he has cows) Could be just defending his home territory. At any rate, he is telling you to get the heck out of there. But using my under thinking/simple ways as JF calls it, it is a sound only bulls make. And it tells me where he is.......Time for a little still hunt eh Pete?

Bulls don\'t lip bawl! Only hunter/callers do it. But just in case I may be wrong, the next time you happen to see a bull flutter his lips I hope you get it on video. I\'d like to see that! :haha: :mock: :dance2: :mg:

Wayne Carlton used to call it the Mad Scream. Elknut had no idea how to even do it until I told him how in a phone conversation. And once I was talking to Dieter Kaboth about it. He said he just never did master it. Instead, he did the most hi pitched sound on his diaphragm that he could muster up and incorporated a gravely growl with his voice as he screamed it out. For those who may not know it, Dieter is a former world champion caller.
 
WW-Do you consider a lip bawl and challenge bugle or scream to be the same? I have actually seen up close a bull curl his lip when he made a lip bawl bugle, he didn\'t flutter it though. He also drooled a lot which is what I though helped give the bugle that fluttery sound.
 
We\'ll let me get this thread back on a positive track. ;)

I will not drop names, but others have published that the Lipbawl Bugle is really directed at the cows and is more for courting. From the consensus of most that posted, this sound is really a very aggressive and dominant sound.

Flystraight - You mention a charge. Is that after you the hunter gives it or the bull gives it?
 
\"AndyJ\" said:
Does anyone have a good audio of a lip bawl bugle?
Click to expand...

I found a lot of youtube clips of bulls lip bawling but they were buried deep in the videos.

Here\'s one I found right away

[youtube]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gKnqLGED9SQ[/youtube]

At 2:30

Anybody find others?
 
\"JohnFitzgerald\" said:
We\'ll let me get this thread back on a positive track. ;)

I will not drop names, but others have published that the Lipbawl Bugle is really directed at the cows and is more for courting. From the consensus of most that posted, this sound is really a very aggressive and dominant sound.

Flystraight - You mention a charge. Is that after you the hunter gives it or the bull gives it?
Click to expand...

IMO again it is definitely an aggressive sound.
 
while I agree only mature bulls seem to make this sound if you watch the video I see nothing that tells me this bull is really torqued or being aggressive to another bull. I could go with OTCWILL\'s im so excited/horny definition :oops:
 
Here are a couple and if you don\'t think these are lip bawls please explain.

<!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_URx92-6m4\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_URx92-6m4</a><!-- m -->

At 1:36

<!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8</a><!-- m -->


At 2:10
 
\"Tdiesel\" said:
I see nothing that tells me this bull is really torqued or being aggressive to another bull
Click to expand...

I agree with TOD,

I don\'t know, maybe there are varying degrees of lip bawl or maybe when bulls let out that really aggressive scream they unintentionally let out a bawl sound as well. The bugle in the video is what I have heard from a herd bull keeping cows together. The really aggressive lip bawl I have heard is much different.

WRT the new videos. I would call the guard rail video a scream but the river fight is what I think of with the aggressive f-off lip bawl.
 
\"flystrait\" said:
Here are a couple and if you don\'t think these are lip bawls please explain.

<!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_URx92-6m4\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_URx92-6m4</a><!-- m -->

At 1:36

<!-- m --><a class=\"postlink\" href=\"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8\" onclick=\"window.open(this.href);return false;\">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUQcMZLZpx8</a><!-- m -->


At 2:10
Click to expand...

Flystrait brings out a great thought. I\'ve seen these two video multiple times and have often wondered if the \"bawls\" were so close together, they sound like a growly scream. Thoughts? Maybe AndyJ is right, intensity determines true meaning?
 
i dunno more I listen andyj may have a point! intensity which we have discussed before is better to mimic than maybe the actual sound the guardrail video winds blowing muffling sound but I would call that a scream. also an idea floating in my head is maybe these bulls are just hoarse and a lipbawl is just a byproduct or is scare tissue from years of bugling(thus older bulls) and when they really get trying to be loud and intense it just kinda comes out. could be a real intense round up bugle aimed at cows or could be a real intense challenge aimed at another bull. since i havent become a MASTER of the elk laguage I really don\'t have a clue all I know is I use it much like flystraight. In bedding type areas close to them and it can lead to one pissed off bull comming my way. or he dumps his cows and runs the other way making me do a face palm rethinking why I chose to act like a big bull :problem:
 
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