Paris
- Thread starter cnelk
- Start date
Really? There\'s enough dead American kids in France already.
The Barbarians are INSIDE the gates, though. We\'ll have to fight them everywhere, and that includes in France, now, I guess.
Coming to a mall near you, soon.
Our kids are not going to know the security of a Pax Americana like we did.
The Barbarians are INSIDE the gates, though. We\'ll have to fight them everywhere, and that includes in France, now, I guess.
Coming to a mall near you, soon.
Our kids are not going to know the security of a Pax Americana like we did.
It\'s sad. When I talk to my buddies still on active duty I tell them my only regret is the security of our country has went to hell during my 23 years. After 9/11 I always thought of a quote by Thomas Paine. \"If there must be trouble let it be in my day, that my child may have peace.\"
About a year ago I briefed a unit on terrorism and opsec. I didn\'t use any classified data, everything was readily available online. My audience had many senior officers who I was certain would find my brief insubordinate. I opened with a slide of James Foley on his knees. I then showed the response of the Soldier\'s Commander in Chief-Obama playing golf after he pretended to care about that video. I went on to quote some stats and explain that those same people are here and it\'s very easy for them to pull off a kidnapping of a Soldier or a shooting spree of a soft target. When we have a leader like we have we send a message saying we are weak.
I guess John Kerry can go over and have James Taylor sing another song and it will all be okay!
About a year ago I briefed a unit on terrorism and opsec. I didn\'t use any classified data, everything was readily available online. My audience had many senior officers who I was certain would find my brief insubordinate. I opened with a slide of James Foley on his knees. I then showed the response of the Soldier\'s Commander in Chief-Obama playing golf after he pretended to care about that video. I went on to quote some stats and explain that those same people are here and it\'s very easy for them to pull off a kidnapping of a Soldier or a shooting spree of a soft target. When we have a leader like we have we send a message saying we are weak.
I guess John Kerry can go over and have James Taylor sing another song and it will all be okay!
I hear and read a lot of misguided ideas about dealing with ISIS. I am no authority, but have read a few things to put into perspective. ISIS is Islam on steroids, and they are growing rapidly. ISIS has been more at war against Shiites and moderate Muslims than they have been against any other group. There are millions that have fled, or been displaced by these terrorists. They consider anyone that is not as radical as themselves to be in violation of the Koran and worthy of death. So they have also killed far more moderate Muslims than any other group. Fleeing from them to go to non Muslims makes a Muslim worthy of death.
ISIS wants to return to 7th century Islamic law. They want to return to crucifixions and other forms of merciless execution. Ultimately they are wanting to literally bring on the Apocalypse. They believe they will ultimately win, and are vowing to carry on through their children and grandchildren to institute their strict and conservative understanding of the Koran, and rid the world of infidels.
Today France started bombing ISIS facilities in Syria. The trouble is that, these and other targets were already identified and approved. The U.S. and France was waiting until there were significant ISIS people there, being trained, before bombing. Now France has started, but we don\'t know yet if anyone was there. We just saw a knee jerk reaction to a huge problem, for political purposes.
It is easy to get into wars, but hard to get out. They will cost far more in lives and money than most people want to admit. It is interesting that it was France that warned us that going into Iraq was going to lead to a widespread war. We showed them what we thought of their U.N. vote by changing the name of French Fries to Freedom Fries. The Republicans howled about the French government then. Now they are crying for war against those that attacked France. I am sure glad we have cooler heads in charge now. Maybe some aught to read what General Shinseki had to say to Congress before we invaded Iraq. The Bush cronies claimed he was greatly exaggerating the costs and troops, the effort would lead to. He was forced to leave his Army position of Chief of Staff because of his testimony that did not fit the Bush Administration agenda. Actually, as we know now, his estimate was way too low.
Actually, hate this political crap on a good hunting forum. I would sure be pleased to see this whole thread removed.
ISIS wants to return to 7th century Islamic law. They want to return to crucifixions and other forms of merciless execution. Ultimately they are wanting to literally bring on the Apocalypse. They believe they will ultimately win, and are vowing to carry on through their children and grandchildren to institute their strict and conservative understanding of the Koran, and rid the world of infidels.
Today France started bombing ISIS facilities in Syria. The trouble is that, these and other targets were already identified and approved. The U.S. and France was waiting until there were significant ISIS people there, being trained, before bombing. Now France has started, but we don\'t know yet if anyone was there. We just saw a knee jerk reaction to a huge problem, for political purposes.
It is easy to get into wars, but hard to get out. They will cost far more in lives and money than most people want to admit. It is interesting that it was France that warned us that going into Iraq was going to lead to a widespread war. We showed them what we thought of their U.N. vote by changing the name of French Fries to Freedom Fries. The Republicans howled about the French government then. Now they are crying for war against those that attacked France. I am sure glad we have cooler heads in charge now. Maybe some aught to read what General Shinseki had to say to Congress before we invaded Iraq. The Bush cronies claimed he was greatly exaggerating the costs and troops, the effort would lead to. He was forced to leave his Army position of Chief of Staff because of his testimony that did not fit the Bush Administration agenda. Actually, as we know now, his estimate was way too low.
Actually, hate this political crap on a good hunting forum. I would sure be pleased to see this whole thread removed.
Swede,
You are spot on in your assessment. I have kept abreast of this for many years. The thing about defeating ISIS is defeating their ideas. They beat us to pieces when it comes to propaganda. Sure there is a place for military intervention as well but it\'s not the means to the end. I agree it is depressing and probably doesn\'t belong on a hunting forum, it\'s just good to vent sometimes.
You are spot on in your assessment. I have kept abreast of this for many years. The thing about defeating ISIS is defeating their ideas. They beat us to pieces when it comes to propaganda. Sure there is a place for military intervention as well but it\'s not the means to the end. I agree it is depressing and probably doesn\'t belong on a hunting forum, it\'s just good to vent sometimes.
Sorry I just immersed myself in politics and foreign policy after 9/11. I felt like that was my generation\'s fight. The fight has lasted much longer than it should have and I could write a book on the mistakes made. I fear future generations will be in this if we don\'t adopt the correct strategies. Our military has become very PC and many may not understand how to implement the right tactics to change ideology. Remember the Geneva Conventions does not apply as some leaders would have us believe.
Steven, I was just kidding you. This is all I know. I don\'t comprehend the whole problem. Therefore, I don\'t have the answer(s). I don\'t think bombs and blazing guns are going to get us where we want to be. It is just not that simple. They ultimately may be a part of the solution, but I don\'t have any confidence in any cowboy mentality. To me it looks like that will just exacerbate the problem. This is a time for the civilized world leaders to get their heads together, and to come up with a comprehensive working policy.
We have been going to war a lot since the late 1940s. None of the major engagements have netted us what we had hoped for.
We have been going to war a lot since the late 1940s. None of the major engagements have netted us what we had hoped for.
At this point we are victims of our own PC and lack of clandestine operations. Many say we should not support the Al-Assad regime. Those who oppose him offer no alternatives because they have none. It\'s like Hussein. He served a purpose in creating stability in a region. To stop the ISIS movement, the region will have to be stabilized by leaders. Likely brutal leaders as Hussein was. Are we willing to align ourselves and arm such a regime? Remember it will be a pseudo proxy war against Iran to establish those type of regimes.
Our government can\'t come together on supporting our own law enforcement officers!
Our government can\'t come together on supporting our own law enforcement officers!
cohunter14
Administrator
- Jul 10, 2017
- 5,355
I think this is good that we can have an open debate about something like this without getting out of control. My question for you, Swede, is how do we solve the problem? Just sit back, let it continue, and continue to leave our borders open so anyone can come in? Truthfully, I am shocked that this happened in a place like Paris instead of here. It would be a heck of a lot easier for people to access our country and do something like this. Based on this quote, I assume you agree that ISIS is a problem and will continue to be, so how would you fix the situation?
To be frank, I am not sure that war is the answer, but I have yet to hear a better idea on how to solve the problem. But let\'s be honest, it is a huge problem when they want to wipe you and I and any other American off the face of the earth. I don\'t think we can sit back and watch them continue to grow. Something needs to be done to stop them.
\"Swede\" said:
To be frank, I am not sure that war is the answer, but I have yet to hear a better idea on how to solve the problem. But let\'s be honest, it is a huge problem when they want to wipe you and I and any other American off the face of the earth. I don\'t think we can sit back and watch them continue to grow. Something needs to be done to stop them.
now theres another hot topic.....\"Swede\" said:Dog gonnit razorback. I was trying to stir the pot and you come in and agree with me. I am losing my touch.
Maybe I will need to start my own thread on police brutality. At least it\'s kinda like huntin. There are guns involved. :downthumb:
\"bnsafe\" said:
I agree but it will be my kids and grand kids fighting them in the streets of your local city...
\"Swede\" said:Dog gonnit razorback. I was trying to stir the pot and you come in and agree with me. I am losing my touch.
Maybe I will need to start my own thread on police brutality. At least it\'s kinda like huntin. There are guns involved. :downthumb:
Ya know me I just got to stir the pot...
No need for \"rules of engagement\" fighting ISIS just kill um all and let God or Allah sort um out...
ISIS seems not to have a problems with killing um all, so why should we????
My vent is over... :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
\"cohunter14\" said:
There has been war in that part of the world for thousands of years. With all of the various factions wanting control of everything, and \"other\" Muslims being infidels, the pot is boiling over. The problems grew steadily through the twentieth century. Presidents and prime ministers have tried to solve it all to no avail. Still my advise is don\'t panic. Don\'t run around like your hair is on fire. I have read the final chapter on all of this. To be sure, there will be an apocalypse, but Christians be of good cheer. Jesus Christ is coming again. He will overthrow all of His enemies, and set up His righteous rule. There will be peace. Jesus is in ultimate control.
In the mean time you can worry, distrust everyone, panic, blame everyone, and be miserable, or you can pray, trust Jesus, and wait on Him. I will also listen to the presidential candidates and vote for the one that presents the most reasonable approach to dealing with that region and the other challenges our Nation faces. What you decide to do is up to you.
Guys, you are on your own discussing Paris and the Middle East from here on out. I am pulling the plug on my computer for a few days and taking it in to be serviced.
The most of my daily Scripture reading this morning was the 119th Psalm. It is always spot on and reassuring. It is a good place to focus.
The most of my daily Scripture reading this morning was the 119th Psalm. It is always spot on and reassuring. It is a good place to focus.
cohunter14
Administrator
- Jul 10, 2017
- 5,355
You bring up valid points Swede and I share in many of your beliefs. I think the toughest part is how do we keep them at war in their countries and not allow them to bring it to ours (or France or anyone else). The two logical things I have heard is to first, secure our borders and don\'t allow anyone in from those countries. It seems harsh for those folks who want to escape, but if they don\'t like it over there, they should stand up and fight. Harsh, but it\'s the only way to make sure those lunatics don\'t enter our country.
The second idea I like is to fight these folks with drones, just like they did with Jihadi John. It might sound expensive, but is it really? When you compare the price of having soldiers over there, setting up camps, feeding them, weapons, etc, I would think drones would be cheap in comparison. When you factor in not losing human lives, it makes even more sense to me. I find it funny when you see videos of ISIS and they are all out in there black uniforms shooting guns at a range. How could we not snoop that out with satellites and send a drone and blow them away?
I still think something has to be done, one way or another. Even if that is just not allowing people into our country. We cannot just wait and see if ISIS brings about the apocalypse.
The second idea I like is to fight these folks with drones, just like they did with Jihadi John. It might sound expensive, but is it really? When you compare the price of having soldiers over there, setting up camps, feeding them, weapons, etc, I would think drones would be cheap in comparison. When you factor in not losing human lives, it makes even more sense to me. I find it funny when you see videos of ISIS and they are all out in there black uniforms shooting guns at a range. How could we not snoop that out with satellites and send a drone and blow them away?
I still think something has to be done, one way or another. Even if that is just not allowing people into our country. We cannot just wait and see if ISIS brings about the apocalypse.
