Elk Hunting Forum - elk language

[ctdad]

I\'ve listened to all of elknuts teachings. I\'ve also subscribed to Chris Roe\'s website and listened to all of his teachings as well. Recently, I\'ve been introduced to Corey Jacobsen\'s slightly more basic and to the point ideas of elk communication.

How do you \"communicate\" with the elk when hunting during the rut?

I\'m settling my pendulum somewhere in between trying name and understand every sound (elkut and roe) and only using three sounds every time regardless (jacobsen).

 

[elkmtngear]

I think I spend more time \"mocking\" elk than trying to dazzle them with my knowledge of elk language.

I might only use the 3 basic sounds...but I vary the emotion. If I\'m close and I cut a bull off...I\'ll be trying my best to mock his tone. I don\'t care what he is specifically saying at that time...I\'m going to try to emulate it.

Spike squeal and nervous bark are a couple of other \"weapons\" I might use depending on the situation.

I do the same thing turkey hunting sometimes...especially with a lead hen with gobblers in tow. They do not like to be mocked

 

[cnelk]

I listen for elk, I look for fresh elk sign and I communicate with them differently each day.
Some days they like this call, some days that call.
Some days raking and stomping [havent seen that call for sale yet]

I dont want to have to remember everything I read or saw online when quick, fast decisions are needed to be made.
Just because it works for someone else, it may or may not work for you.

But I can guarantee you that not matter what call you use, there will be NO COMMUNICATING if there arent elk in the area.

Thats why I tend to listen for elk and find fresh elk sign FIRST.
Let them do the talking, then make a plan.

 

[ctdad]

Cnelk,
does that mean you don\'t utilize location bugles?

 

[cnelk]

You are correct

But I must tell you what works for me may not work for others

 

[Deertick]

I think if you read between the lines of most of the callers and \"instructors\" ... you\'ll hear that emotion is the key feature they differentiate.

Roe is probably the most like this. I\'ve seen his series, and he does break down his calling with a very fine-toothed comb ... but when it gets down to it, the differences are just ways that he tries to impart emotion, frustration, excitement, irritability, etc.

I \"hear\" him say, basically, that he is trying to sort out what the \"mood\" of the animal is. As some say, bulls like to fight and mate, but there are are different levels of intensity in how much they like to do either, and he tried to show how they impart \"mood\" in sounds.

I bet ol\' Corey has some variation, too, even if he doesn\'t consciously realize it.

 

[elkmtngear]

Thats why I tend to listen for elk and find fresh elk sign FIRST.
Let them do the talking, then make a plan.

I\'m with you on this, Brad.

 

[cnelk]

Lets put it this way:

I come and hunt with you. We hike for a 1 1/2 miles thru some great elk terrain.
We dont see a track, no fresh sign, hear nothing, NADA.

Do we stop and call or keep going, listening & looking for elk sign?

 

[elkmtngear]

Lets put it this way:

I come and hunt with you. We hike for a 1 1/2 miles thru some great elk terrain.
We dont see a track, no fresh sign, hear nothing, NADA.

Do we stop and call or keep going, listening & looking for elk sign?

I\'m going to ask you if you want to hike out and drive to another drainage I know of...would you come with me? :eh:

 

[ORelksniper]

Early in my elk hunting career I only knew, and used, very basic sounds. That approach worked great because there were elk in the area. If there are no elk around it doesn\'t matter what you say or how you say it.

The past few years I\'ve got caught up in learning everything I can about the elk language. While it may be important, it just didn\'t work for me. I became overly analytical of what the elk were saying and missed several opportunities because I couldn\'t decide what move to make. The area I hunt doesn\'t have lots of elk so encounters are separated by days of looking. Bottom line is, I\'m going back to my old basic sounds when I need them and move in on the elk when I find them.

 

[bowhunter]

Lets put it this way:

I come and hunt with you. We hike for a 1 1/2 miles thru some great elk terrain.
We dont see a track, no fresh sign, hear nothing, NADA.

Do we stop and call or keep going, listening & looking for elk sign?

Ok Brad time for some elk education. I understand if you don\'t hear or see anything you would keep looking. How many times do you bump into them and off they go. I can scan the timber for them but lets face it 6 pairs of elk eyes usually spot the hunter before the hunter spots them. Now what do I do?

 

[cnelk]

Not necessarily should the elk spot you first. It seems of late that I see / hear them first. But have I bumped elk? Of course. But I would rather do that than hunt a spot barren of elk.
Calling elk is just part of the overall picture.

 

[cnelk]

Lets put it this way:

I come and hunt with you. We hike for a 1 1/2 miles thru some great elk terrain.
We dont see a track, no fresh sign, hear nothing, NADA.

Do we stop and call or keep going, listening & looking for elk sign?

I\'m going to ask you if you want to hike out and drive to another drainage I know of...would you come with me? :eh:

Race you to the truck Jeff

 

[ctdad]

I think if you read between the lines of most of the callers and \"instructors\" ... you\'ll hear that emotion is the key feature they differentiate.

Roe is probably the most like this. I\'ve seen his series, and he does break down his calling with a very fine-toothed comb ... but when it gets down to it, the differences are just ways that he tries to impart emotion, frustration, excitement, irritability, etc.

I \"hear\" him say, basically, that he is trying to sort out what the \"mood\" of the animal is. As some say, bulls like to fight and mate, but there are are different levels of intensity in how much they like to do either, and he tried to show how they impart \"mood\" in sounds.

I bet ol\' Corey has some variation, too, even if he doesn\'t consciously realize it.

Good point. I\'ve learned something from all of the \"instructors\" I\'ve studied but you are right. Emotion is a common theme.

 

[siskiyou]

I\'m happy to see this discussion, because there\'s been something about being so adamant regarding understanding exactly what elk are saying with every little sound that hasn\'t rung true with me. I started hunting/calling elk in the mid 1980\'s and the mentality was interpreting levels of intensity in the calls, rather than strict interpretations of every chuckle, etc.

I\'ve digested most of the new, more sophisticated approaches and have benefited from much of it. But I\'m wondering about concluding that every time a bull chuckles it\'s because he has cows with him, or every time he gives a simple bugle he\'s wandering around looking for cows. Maybe it\'s just that he\'s hornier that morning than he was the morning before...and the intensity in his calling has increased, so he chuckles. I spend way too much time on You-Tube watching elk hunts, and it seems to me that there are bulls without cows who are chuckling, and there are bulls with cows that are only bugling.

Maybe we\'re giving the elk too much credit regarding the sophistication of their vocalizations, as well as their strict adherence to those \'elk vocalization\' rules. After-all, they don\'t really have a Websters dictionary of elk language.

Anyway, those are some of my ideas on the subject...certainly open to correction.

 

[elkmtngear]

Welcome Siskiyou...and very good observations IMHO.

BTW, I\'ve arrowed some very nice muleys up in your neck of the woods...we are practically neigbors!

 

[Deertick]

Siskiyou ... I\'m with you.

Think of talking to kids while in the car ... there\'s a difference between \"Cut it out\", \"CUT IT OUT!\", and pulling over on the side of the road, getting out and yelling \"NOW CUT IT OUT, DAMMIT!!!\".

All of them mean exactly the same thing, which is why it\'s so frustrating, and why I have no hair left.

I could imagine an elk, watching the road (as in the \"Drive-by elk hunting\" thread) and saying \"Now, see that? THAT is a Level 3 agitated-type grunt. When you hear that, all the kid has to do is say \'But\' ... just like that ... nothing fancy, just \'But\' ... and the human bull will come absolutely unglued.\"

 

[flystrait]

Siskiyou ... I\'m with you.

Think of talking to kids while in the car ... there\'s a difference between \"Cut it out\", \"CUT IT OUT!\", and pulling over on the side of the road, getting out and yelling \"NOW CUT IT OUT, DAMMIT!!!\".

All of them mean exactly the same thing, which is why it\'s so frustrating, and why I have no hair left.

I could imagine an elk, watching the road (as in the \"Drive-by elk hunting\" thread) and saying \"Now, see that? THAT is a Level 3 agitated-type grunt. When you hear that, all the kid has to do is say \'But\' ... just like that ... nothing fancy, just \'But\' ... and the human bull will come absolutely unglued.\"

x2! I believe the same things. I hunt different than the next guy and they hunt different than me and etc. But the same conclusion is starting to rise to the top. Like WW say\'s and I agree keep it simple. I never want to put myself in a situation of not being able to react right or wrong because I just pulled out the elk dictionary and can\'t find the page of what they are saying before they leave. By the way the so called dictionary was written by a human not the elk. It just makes me think its more about marketing and sales..IMO

 

[WW]

OK,OK, I\'ve been sitting here biting my tongue long enough. Flystrait pretty much summed it up when he stated it makes him thing it may be (more) about marketing and sales. Personally, I think it is (all) about marketing and sales.

But lets talk about a guy who gets a lot of press when it comes to elk hunting know how. Corey Jacobsen.

Corey Jacobsen is a 7 time world champion elk caller. So that tells me right there that he can most likely make just about any sound an elk can make. But instead, he chooses to keep it simple. His dad, Rockie Jacobsen, is also a multi time world champion. Hmm! I\'ll just about bet that Corey learned how to hunt from his father. I\'m also relatively sure that they both may use other calls at times when hunting. But Corey emphasizes just three elk sounds in all of his seminars. Location bugle, cow mews, challenge bugle. KISS

The main thing an elk tells me when they make a sound is where they are. All the rest of it is strictly emotion or excitement. So if you take a lot of the KISS will work just fine. Always has for me.

 

[Deertick]

This is a great thread ... I\'m learning quite a bit.