iccyman001
New member
- Apr 30, 2014
- 5,489
Does anyone else have more personal experiences that they can post?
When they were either too aggressive or not enough?
When they were either too aggressive or not enough?
What does "aggressive" mean
- Thread starter AndyJ
- Start date
Paul Mendel promotes \'run & gun\' because he has bugles, books and CDs to sell.
He would promote tree stands if he was brave enough to try it for elk [ or if he thought he could make a dollar]
Anyone who has spent more than a few days in the elk woods has \'blown it\' for one reason or another.
Too aggressive can be as simple as not watching the wind and proceeding.
Not aggressive enough can mean not knowing what thermals can do and how they \'flow\' down ridges and holding back when you should get your butt in there!
Or holding back and calling thinking the elk will come to you.
But being too aggressive, or not aggressive enough isnt necessarily a bad thing, because it means you are having elk ENCOUNTERS!
A bad thing is NOT having those encounters.
My experiences may not be very helpful, because not everyone hunts the way I do.
For instance, I cow call from my tree stand and Swede doesnt.
Am I being too aggressive?
He would promote tree stands if he was brave enough to try it for elk [ or if he thought he could make a dollar]
Anyone who has spent more than a few days in the elk woods has \'blown it\' for one reason or another.
Too aggressive can be as simple as not watching the wind and proceeding.
Not aggressive enough can mean not knowing what thermals can do and how they \'flow\' down ridges and holding back when you should get your butt in there!
Or holding back and calling thinking the elk will come to you.
But being too aggressive, or not aggressive enough isnt necessarily a bad thing, because it means you are having elk ENCOUNTERS!
A bad thing is NOT having those encounters.
My experiences may not be very helpful, because not everyone hunts the way I do.
For instance, I cow call from my tree stand and Swede doesnt.
Am I being too aggressive?
I\'m pretty much with cnelk on this.
I consider aggressive hunting as accepting it\'s probably going to be a one-and-done deal. I get in close to the herd and totally mock the bull from someplace close, but where he can\'t see me. He\'s going to do one of two things: either trot over and give me a frontal shot at 20 yards, which I won\'t take, or he\'ll follow the lead cow as she takes the herd away. With a partner it\'s much more effective if you can get the shooter in the right spot ahead of time. Solo? Much tougher to get a good shot at a good angle. The few I\'ve killed this way were sho as they turned, which I could do with my stickbows but not sure with a compound.
We\'ve done it successfully a few times solo on herd bulls, but more often it doesn\'t happen and I never see them again for one reason or another. I\'ve killed herd bulls in every sort of way, so I don\'t lock onto any one tactic.
Otherwise, everything else is just elk hunting, taking what it gives you and guessing right more often as you learn more. I feel most comfortable being \"passive-aggressive\" (I know - groans all around..) where I get close to the elk and then figure out how to hunt them or whether to back out.
I consider aggressive hunting as accepting it\'s probably going to be a one-and-done deal. I get in close to the herd and totally mock the bull from someplace close, but where he can\'t see me. He\'s going to do one of two things: either trot over and give me a frontal shot at 20 yards, which I won\'t take, or he\'ll follow the lead cow as she takes the herd away. With a partner it\'s much more effective if you can get the shooter in the right spot ahead of time. Solo? Much tougher to get a good shot at a good angle. The few I\'ve killed this way were sho as they turned, which I could do with my stickbows but not sure with a compound.
We\'ve done it successfully a few times solo on herd bulls, but more often it doesn\'t happen and I never see them again for one reason or another. I\'ve killed herd bulls in every sort of way, so I don\'t lock onto any one tactic.
Otherwise, everything else is just elk hunting, taking what it gives you and guessing right more often as you learn more. I feel most comfortable being \"passive-aggressive\" (I know - groans all around..) where I get close to the elk and then figure out how to hunt them or whether to back out.
G
Guest
Guest
I can add a little here as well. I believe the amount of days you have to hunt also dictate aggressive level.
What I mean is on day one I am usually just happy to be out there and in awe that I am hunting once again !! I am no way willing or wanting to blow elk out of my area that I\'ll be hunting for the next week or 10 days !! If I go in and blow them out on day one I may as well find another spot and that could take major days away from my hunt. But come day 12 or 13 of a 14 day hunt YES I am going to be very aggressive !!
The way I look at it is I\'m done till next Sept if I leave empty handed. So you darn right I\'m going to get aggressive and if I blow them out then so be it at least you gave it a whirl !!
Also on another note if you find a herd bull then the cat and mouse game is on. This is the rivalry I\'m looking for every season. Sometimes you win and sometimes (most) the bull wins !! LOL
I hunted one bull that I would move in on and no matter what tactic I would use be it cow calling or bugle or challenging him he would gather his cows and head over the ridge and was gone every time !! This went on for 3 days and finally he really ticked me off by being a coward and running ! So I got very aggressive and smashed trees like a mad man and tore earth from the ground and was just plain in a foul mood and you know what ?............................This turned him from a wussy to a really peeved off bull coming looking for fight !! He charged right over and was screaming his head off the whole way in !!
Did I shoot him at 5 yards ? NO !!
As I was raking like a mad manic I accidentally knocked my bowstring off my bow and it was useless !! Out of commission !!
That bull came and paralleled me as I back pedaled down the trail and the herd bull escorted me OUT of his area and screamed bugles at me for 20 minutes not 30 yards across from me !! It was the most fascinating elk hunt I have ever been on and I will never forget it !! So as you can see if I had note got all pissy and through a fit that scenario would never have unfolded as that bull would have just ran away with his cows again and again !!
Now I\'m not saying to do this every time as you must read each encounter and act on it as it unfolds but it does pay to be aggressive at times !!
Great thread here guys so keep your experiences coming and lets learn from each other !!
Trav :dance2: :dance2:
What I mean is on day one I am usually just happy to be out there and in awe that I am hunting once again !! I am no way willing or wanting to blow elk out of my area that I\'ll be hunting for the next week or 10 days !! If I go in and blow them out on day one I may as well find another spot and that could take major days away from my hunt. But come day 12 or 13 of a 14 day hunt YES I am going to be very aggressive !!
The way I look at it is I\'m done till next Sept if I leave empty handed. So you darn right I\'m going to get aggressive and if I blow them out then so be it at least you gave it a whirl !!
Also on another note if you find a herd bull then the cat and mouse game is on. This is the rivalry I\'m looking for every season. Sometimes you win and sometimes (most) the bull wins !! LOL
I hunted one bull that I would move in on and no matter what tactic I would use be it cow calling or bugle or challenging him he would gather his cows and head over the ridge and was gone every time !! This went on for 3 days and finally he really ticked me off by being a coward and running ! So I got very aggressive and smashed trees like a mad man and tore earth from the ground and was just plain in a foul mood and you know what ?............................This turned him from a wussy to a really peeved off bull coming looking for fight !! He charged right over and was screaming his head off the whole way in !!
Did I shoot him at 5 yards ? NO !!
As I was raking like a mad manic I accidentally knocked my bowstring off my bow and it was useless !! Out of commission !!
That bull came and paralleled me as I back pedaled down the trail and the herd bull escorted me OUT of his area and screamed bugles at me for 20 minutes not 30 yards across from me !! It was the most fascinating elk hunt I have ever been on and I will never forget it !! So as you can see if I had note got all pissy and through a fit that scenario would never have unfolded as that bull would have just ran away with his cows again and again !!
Now I\'m not saying to do this every time as you must read each encounter and act on it as it unfolds but it does pay to be aggressive at times !!
Great thread here guys so keep your experiences coming and lets learn from each other !!
Trav :dance2: :dance2:
JohnFitzgerald
New member
- Mar 31, 2014
- 1,108
Wouldn\'t failure to hunt the wind/thermals be more the right vs. the wrong way to hunt?
Here\'s the definition of \"aggressive\".
ag?gres?sive
+ready or likely to attack or confront; characterized by or resulting from aggression.
+pursuing one\'s aims and interests forcefully, sometimes unduly so.
To expand on Wapiti\'s thread, I\'ve seen some herd bulls that are rather happy to just verbally battle. As long as they had the cows under control they were in no big hurry to act. Sometimes, you have no other choice than to attempt a break up of the herd. But if you guess wrong, running at a satellite that has no cows can mean a lost opportunity.
I reference the definition again, ag?gres?sive-pursuing one\'s aims and interests forcefully, sometimes unduly so.
Can making the mistake and running at a satellite also be considered right vs. wrong? If so you must then raise the question, can some aggression also be considered right vs. wrong? Should aggressive tactics only be used by the experienced hunter?
Jaquomo - I personally would never groan at someones opinion.
Here\'s the definition of \"aggressive\".
ag?gres?sive
+ready or likely to attack or confront; characterized by or resulting from aggression.
+pursuing one\'s aims and interests forcefully, sometimes unduly so.
To expand on Wapiti\'s thread, I\'ve seen some herd bulls that are rather happy to just verbally battle. As long as they had the cows under control they were in no big hurry to act. Sometimes, you have no other choice than to attempt a break up of the herd. But if you guess wrong, running at a satellite that has no cows can mean a lost opportunity.
I reference the definition again, ag?gres?sive-pursuing one\'s aims and interests forcefully, sometimes unduly so.
Can making the mistake and running at a satellite also be considered right vs. wrong? If so you must then raise the question, can some aggression also be considered right vs. wrong? Should aggressive tactics only be used by the experienced hunter?
Jaquomo - I personally would never groan at someones opinion.
\"JohnFitzgerald\" said:
I dont think so.
I have pushed the limits on being aggressive when it comes to the wind.
We all know how fickle the wind can be.
Just because our little puff bottle of powder tells us what the wind is doing in the near proximity, it doesnt tell us a thing what its doing 100 yds away.
We can only take a guess guess.
I was telling a buddy just the other day that I frequently hunt slopes by going downhill and I then put the thermals into my side, using it as a crosswind, not into my face.
I want to intercept the elk as they are headed uphill and quite often when I call them in, they DO THE EXACT SAME THING by coming in at a crosswind.
To me, that is being aggressive by using crosswinds
cohunter14
Administrator
- Jul 10, 2017
- 5,327
\"AndyJ\" said:
Andy, great thread! I have to comment on this portion because I was actually going to start a thread revolving around this tactic. What got me thinking about this is the other day I was chatting with someone and they were talking about how they randomly will see deer while running a trail through the woods as a workout. This is in an area that the deer might be used to some people, but it isn\'t in the middle of the city either. Anyway, his thought was that if he was running the trail, the deer didn\'t pay much attention to him and he could get within feet of them. However, if he stopped and looked at them, they would take off.
I had a very similar experience at one point while hunting. I had a herd of 40-50 elk run by me inside of ten yards. Of course I am sitting there with my rifle and a bull tag and all I see is cows...one by one, trotting by me. Once all of them had passed, I thought what the heck, I don\'t care if I spook them and maybe I missed a bull running through with them, so I quickly ran after them...and they all STOPPED! Literally, the entire herd stopped and just looked at me while I scanned around trying to find antlers. Keep in mind, I am decked out in hunter orange, not abc camo pattern. I never found a bull in the group and eventually they all took off, but I was shocked at how that worked. As a side note, this was in one of the most heavily hunted units in Colorado during an OTC rifle hunt.
Needless to say, if the opportunity ever presented itself, I would highly recommend trying this to an archer. If they haven\'t spotted you previously, this can work very well in my opinion!
Really tough to define exactly what works in terms of being aggressive. I charge in on elk if I know they can\'t see me sometimes but for the most part I am pretty careful. When I think of times that being aggressive can be the difference between a shot and not, I think of situations where I made a bold but necc. move to get a shot. Brad just posted a video \"A Magical Morning In the Elk Woods\" which is a perfect example for what I\'m talking about. The shooter gets in a situation where he just doesn\'t quite have an angle. In my experience, sitting tight in these situations will lead to nothing most of the time. He gets lucky and the bull finally commits. I would have made a move to get the shot. This \"carefully aggressive\" technique is a necc. tool in my arsenal and has worked time and again for me. Oh yea, I learned this from countless experiences sitting tight when I \"almost\" had a shot. That\'ll end with you either getting lucky or skunked.
I couldn\'t agree more and hope to provide some direction to all those that hear the advice, \"be aggressive\" without any further explanation.
A couple factors that make being aggressive possible for me are wind and terrain. The, hands down most important factor is the wind. Like all hunting you will never,never,NEVER fool an elk\'s nose. If I detect a hint of bad wind. I leave-period. You won\'t win this one and in my experience elk will leave the country when they smell a hunter. I would like to drive this point home as much as possible. The reason being, most guys, especially newer hunters can\'t seem to back away when an elk is close or they see a huge set of antlers and the wind shifts. They think ,\"maybe I\'ll luck out\". You won\'t. If the wind is blowing from you to the elk or close, you\'ll get busted. So rule number 1-the wind has to be good.
The second factor that helps is terrain. Rolling, dense, dark timber is best and the worse the visibility the better. It makes the elk hard to see and getting a good shot difficult but it makes you hard to see as well. Especially if you are calling, an elk has no reason to think you\'re not an elk. As a side note, I don\'t usually like to call when I\'m within a hundred yards or so. Again, the situation will dictate. I don\'t endorse many products as being better than others but I swear by predator spring green or green deception patterns. That stuff is amazing I have had elk and deer looking right through me at very close range. It isn\'t just an isolated event either. It seems to be the norm.
You definitely need to be cautious when you move. I like the cat analogy. Watch even a house cat stalk its prey. It moves slowly and methodically an usually only when its prey is not looking at it. That\'s how you need to move as well. Without over complicating the issue. If there is a light breeze, enough to get the brush moving a little, it helps a lot. Try to move when the brush is moving.
