Why are bows so expensive?

D

Deertick

New member
Mar 2, 2014
1,763
I don\'t mean to take this thread in some \"They\'re ripping us off\" direction. I have no idea what the margins are in the archery industry, but I would suspect they are actually pretty narrow, both on the upper end and the lower end. Economics demands that in a competitive market like the one for bows, margins will be small. It seems to me that hunters are generally comfortable with spending either $400-$500 or somewhere around $1000 on a weapon (archery or firearm) and the market has filled those demand points very well.

(BTW, I suspect that the profit made on a $400 bow is likely more than that made on a $1000 bow -- those greedy capitalists are more capable of \"ripping you off\" on the lower end.)

No, my question has to do with the substrate of the bow itself.

It seems that the high cost is due to engineering, for sure, but also materials. What is it about the material of bows that is high cost? I don\'t even really know what the things are made of.

I will say that I don\'t think we\'re really paying for fit and finish. Even some of the higher end bows seem to lack in that area. Sure, there is a value that many people place on the brand name alone, and customer service is in there, too.

So, what space-age material, or Buck Rogers engineering, makes it tough to deliver a high end Bowtech for $200?
 
#1 by far is advertising. And industry insider claimed about $200 from each Mathews bow goes into advertising. Take it for what its worth but advertising includes sponsorships, donations to groups and those four page inserts in Outdoor Life.

As far as the bow itself there are some things to look at.

A good example is the riser material and how it\'s made. The aluminum is very expensive High grade like 6061 (?) A bow manufacturer friend of mine places orders in the 10,000 to 15,000 lb range. When oil prices were fluctuating like crazy a few years ago he got a quote for between $4-$5 per lb and that quote was valid for exactly 30 minutes!

So, now all you machinists can chime in, but it was explained to me this way. Cheaper bows may be \"machined\" out of a molded piece of aluminum that is generally the shape of the riser. However, as a molding cools, the majority of its strength is in the skin, which is machined and thrown away. Thus, lower end bows tend to have thick or bulky risers to retain strength.

Higher end bows are machined out of one solid block called a billet that maintains the same properties throughout the material. This block has to be long and thick enough to machine the whole riser, and some of those risers are quite long. The more twists and angle and horizons the riser has, the more machining and waste there is. On some lower end bows you might notice where the riser was machined in two or three pieces then bolted together and hid by a face plate or sticker. This is just to reduce machining and material costs.

So I would say Advertising, machining, material, extras like strings, finish, etc. in that order.

Just a regurgitation from what I learned as a retailer, not a manufacturer. :think:
 
I think a lot of staying up on the competition and ahead of the \'game\' factors into the cost quite a bit.
Something else to think about is just the MSRP of the bow.

Lets say bow XYZ new price tag is $150.
And you take that same bow, disguise it with some camo and then put a $500 new price tag on it.
Which one would you look at?

Most people would glaze over the lower price one and gravitate toward the higher price one.
Why? Because they immediately think it is subpar because of the price.

It\'s called Marketing.

Here is something else I often wonder about to,

Why don\'t bows hold their value? and arrows do???
 
I have a story that might help to understand.

One of the high end bamboo rod builders made a rod for a friend. It was a beautiful rod in looks and performance. He handed it to his friend, and said it\'s $500. The guy looked at, and said....No, I want a good rod. Give me your best. The rod builder took it back, and change a few components on it. Nothing that would add any value to it, and certainly not add any performance to the rod. He just made it look a little different. He handed that rod to his friend, and said...$2000. His friend got a big smile on his face, and said.....That\'s more like it, and paid him.

Never underestimate what someone will pay when they think it\'s the best.
 
I do have to agree that the price of bows seems a little crazy. I have a hard time with the fact that it will probably cost $1,000+ to get into bow hunting, which is the main reason I haven\'t done it yet. I could buy multiple guns for that price or a bunch of other items. Tough to take that plunge.
 
If bow makers could really just put a few $ into a bow and mark it up, then their margins would be huge. I doubt that.

What\'s a wholesale price of a bow? In other words, I bet the retail mark-up is a fair percentage of the bow. And that\'s OK. The retailer, after all, ADDS VALUE by being a personal salesman and usually a mechanic as well. He gives advice, and provides a place to gather with others, and shoot.

But what if I live far away from a bow shop, and never take advantage of it\'s added value? I paid too much, didn\'t I? And not to the manufacturer.

Sure, there\'s something to be said for marking up the price of something, but my guess is that the engineering, machining, etc. as well as the resale value are much different.
 
I suspect quantity of bow sales makes a huge difference. If a manufacturer can increase the demand for their bows, the cost can go down quit a lot.
 
Also John what is with the price of accessories! I can see bows themselves going up in price but several hundred dollars for a sight? Are you kidding me. I use a six pin Apex that I bought for 30 dollars on EBAY that does everything I want it to do and does it well. A person can easily have more money in what\'s on the bow than the bow itself.
 
Accessories are pricey ... with a sight, quiver, and release, you can easily spend another $150-$300. Heck, it\'s possible to find Cabela\'s brand (i.e. generic) sights that cost over $300.

Well, I suspect that the bow manufacturers have a pretty clear idea of what the market will bear. Like rifle makers, and auto makers, they produce things to a price point, rather than just make a product and move their price to \"where they want it.\"

In fact, I suspect that these companies have a much better idea of what the MARKET will tolerate than individual hunters do. So, if they see the market for $500 bows is gaining size, then they compete for that market. Not the whole market, mind you ... that one, the $500 bow market.

But the question really had to do with what qualities of a bow change it from a $300 bow to a $1300 bow. I realize that brand name, reputation, marketing, etc., all enter into it, but I don\'t think we can explain the whole thing based on those things. In other words, my suspicion is that the $1300 bow really is more difficult to make -- whether that means design or production -- and even though that isn\'t the whole thing, I\'m asking ... what design and production differences are expensive to manufacture?
 
\"timberland\" said:
#1 by far is advertising. And industry insider claimed about $200 from each Mathews bow goes into advertising. Take it for what its worth but advertising includes sponsorships, donations to groups and those four page inserts in Outdoor Life.

As far as the bow itself there are some things to look at.

A good example is the riser material and how it\'s made. The aluminum is very expensive High grade like 6061 (?) A bow manufacturer friend of mine places orders in the 10,000 to 15,000 lb range. When oil prices were fluctuating like crazy a few years ago he got a quote for between $4-$5 per lb and that quote was valid for exactly 30 minutes!

So, now all you machinists can chime in, but it was explained to me this way. Cheaper bows may be \"machined\" out of a molded piece of aluminum that is generally the shape of the riser. However, as a molding cools, the majority of its strength is in the skin, which is machined and thrown away. Thus, lower end bows tend to have thick or bulky risers to retain strength.

Higher end bows are machined out of one solid block called a billet that maintains the same properties throughout the material. This block has to be long and thick enough to machine the whole riser, and some of those risers are quite long. The more twists and angle and horizons the riser has, the more machining and waste there is. On some lower end bows you might notice where the riser was machined in two or three pieces then bolted together and hid by a face plate or sticker. This is just to reduce machining and material costs.

So I would say Advertising, machining, material, extras like strings, finish, etc. in that order.

Just a regurgitation from what I learned as a retailer, not a manufacturer. :think:
Click to expand...

This is great info, Barry. I learned a lot.

As a Manufacturer...I can tell you that Carbon Fiber is not cheap. High Grade Aluminum as well. Manufacturers have to make an attempt to maintain 4 tier pricing, especially if they are planning on having their goods in the \"big Box\" Stores (They will lowball their price down to where you are making jack nothing on a big order). Out of your profit margin, you will have to subtract something like 10 to 15 percent for a Rep, 25 percent for an Outfitter, 30 percent for a \"Mom and Pop\" Dealer, 40 percent for a Midline Distributor, and up to 50 percent for a BIG Distributor. And, do not forget advertising costs as mentioned! At this point, are you still covering the cost of Manufacturing (Mold fees, Materials, Labor, Shipping)? How much is left?

One trick I have used a couple times, is to find a Factory Rep, and pick up a bow right when the newest models are shipped out. For example, I just picked up a 2015 Matthews bow for my Wife, because the 2016 models are just coming out, for a pretty significant discount. The bow had never been fired (was hanging on a rack for an entire Year)...and was shipped in the original box with all paperwork.

Going to Sports Shows/ Trade Shows / Archery Shoots etc. can unveil those opportunities...plus you get a chance to handle the bow you are looking for (and possibly even shoot it).
 
That is why I am still shooting a 15 year old bow. I bought it in 2000. A Parker Ultralight 31. It weighs 2.9 lbs bare and shoots 320 IBO. I have added a string stop and quality strings. I could gain a little speed and have parallel limbs for an extra $500-$1000. I am happy with it for now. Maybe some day I will give in. If I find a bargain. Parker just started making the Ultralight again in 2014 or 2015.

I picked up a used Parker UL31 for my son off of Ebay for $135. It came with a QAD HD rest and a G5 sight that list for $130. Then I picked up a new Alpine Soft Lock quiver for $15. I couldn\'t believe nobody bid on it. The list for $59. He is set and happy with it already killed a rabbit back in February.
 
terry, I bought my bow used 3 years ago on ebay for $225 shipped. the bow listed for around $800 when it was new 2 years prior to that.... it was a huge improvement over my 94 model darton! I don\'t see the need to change bows again for a long while....
 
I bought my z7 extreme new in the box with a rhinhart shooting block, release, and some broad heads for $500 cash.

Some people just splurge on things, don\'t use them, then want to buy something new so they unload stuff for cheap. I am usually the guy standing in line with cash to buy from them :upthumb:
 
\"iccyman001\" said:
I bought my z7 extreme new in the box with a rhinhart shooting block, release, and some broad heads for $500 cash.

Some people just splurge on things, don\'t use them, then want to buy something new so they unload stuff for cheap. I am usually the guy standing in line with cash to buy from them :upthumb:
Click to expand...

wow. that is an amazing DEAL!!

i would love a Carbon hoyt 34. used is my only avenue with a carbon bow. if i kept my current rig, i would have no qualms about working on a new hoyt \"on the side\". slowly.
 
I have no idea why they cost so much. I expect because people are willing to pay for them. I went to a bow shop yesterday with my son. It had a range and there was a younger guy shooting. He knew my son and he was showing off his Mathews bows. Both were brand new and he said he had one paid for and the other about 1/4 of the way paid for. All together 3k worth of bows. I asked him if he made any money shooting tournaments with them. His answer no he just likes the way they shot and couldn\'t decide which one to buy so he bought both or at least was making payments on both. I pretended not to think he was extremely stupid and watched him shoot. If people are willing to make payments on bows, companies will charge inflated prices. Sure I have paid a lot for a bow too but 2 a year and finance them!
 
derek, there are good bows out there for good prices. dont let price exclude you from bowhunting. places like archerytalk classifieds have some great deals if your willing to keep looking and offering until you get what you want. my future son n law bought a hoyt afterburner last year, several yr old technology but killed deer just fine, for 250 bucks. you can buy cheaper accessories from places like camofire, walmart, sportsmans guide etc. all you really need is a site and quiver. stabilizers are for show, and yes i have one, but dont htink it makes a diff in hunting situations and you could save some wt you have to carry. i bought a boss hogg real deal site off of archery talk for 100 bucks, and a crx new in the box for 500. you can do better than that if you look. dont wait, you will love bowhunting. just remember when buying a bow, some are draw specific without mods, like hoyt, and some have better draw ranges etc. so make sure you knwo what you need or get one with some range in it.
 
\"cohunter14\" said:
I do have to agree that the price of bows seems a little crazy. I have a hard time with the fact that it will probably cost $1,000+ to get into bow hunting, which is the main reason I haven\'t done it yet. I could buy multiple guns for that price or a bunch of other items. Tough to take that plunge.
Click to expand...

Are they getting cheaper?

Are you getting younger?

Take the leap!
 
\"cohunter14\" said:
I do have to agree that the price of bows seems a little crazy. I have a hard time with the fact that it will probably cost $1,000+ to get into bow hunting, which is the main reason I haven\'t done it yet. I could buy multiple guns for that price or a bunch of other items. Tough to take that plunge.
Click to expand...


I bet if you asked around you would find someone near your home or on this site with a spare they would lend you for a season. You would then be hooked and have no problem taking the plunge. You would probably put off buying your next gun or two to get a decent bow and accessories.
 
No need to spend $1000. There are good bows to be had for a lot less and like Terry said somebody may have an extra bow you could borrow. Scott made some good points be careful when buying a used bow as some are draw length specific and require modules to change the draw length. Also make sure the string and cables are in decent shape. If you get a bow without accessories shoot me a pm. Between my son and I we have quite a bit of archery accessories laying around like sights and quivers and rests.
 
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